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Edmonton Police Working on Hijab Option for Uniform

November 27, 2013  | 

A new uniform piece could 'open doors' for women of other cultures looking to begin a career with the Edmonton Police Service in Canada, reports the Edmonton Sun.

At an Edmonton Police Commission meeting Thursday it was revealed that EPS is working on introducing a hijab option to the uniform.

Natasha Goudar with the Equity, Diversity and Human Rights Unit said the conversation started when a recruiter was asked if EPS would "ever even consider allowing someone to wear a hijab."

Goudar says officers have been working closely with various Muslim communities, talking to Imams about cultural implications and requirements.

Tags: Uniform Accessories, Women's Uniforms, Edmonton Police Service


Comments (85)

Displaying 1 - 85 of 85

Serpico @ 11/27/2013 3:22 PM

If people don't like the Canadian or American laws they are free to get back on a plane and go HOME! This is a pandemic of Muslim Sharia Law hitting North America. Funny how Muslim women can walk around covered up. But if a normal person covered up their face in a Convenience Store, or getting on a Plane. it would be a RED FLAG for a terrorist! My question is?? Is Natasha Goudar going to be pulling over Christians, and Jews. And trying to treat them like Second Class citizens in their own Country? The way Illegal Aliens from Latin America TREAT the citizens. The same ones who pay their welfare checks, and hospital bills etc.

Retired Chief @ 11/27/2013 6:38 PM

More political correctness----we had better wake up before it is too late

Deputy @ 11/28/2013 4:36 AM

What the hell is this world coming to? Why should we bow down and cater to these people? They don't make any effort to change for us, and I don't necessarily think they should. But they can GTFO.

Kurt Hilden @ 11/28/2013 5:01 AM

What, is all of the Western World going mad? Soon you'll mix sharia law and then heads will roll or throats just cut, or a single individual killed by being attacked because he/she deserves i! Look at our PSYCHIATRIST at Fort Hood, killing righteously in the name of his false god! Damn, when will we wake up? These factions of desert rats will cause needless bloodshed until hell freezes over! Oh, you like little girls, "marry" them and rape them with your enormous Johnson and let the kid bleed to death--god's will. Rape animals--god's will! Nuts! Insanity. This so called culture will never assimilate! LEARN it and REMEMBER it!

EODK9Trainer @ 11/28/2013 5:38 AM

I certainly hope this is a joke but apparently not. Please tell me someone has the ability to stop Edmonton from making this mistake.

Mark LaJoye @ 11/28/2013 6:01 AM

Bottom line up front, (BLUF) this a bunch of politically correct B.S.

AZBIGDOG @ 11/28/2013 6:06 AM

So the first time someone gets pulled over or confronted by a masked person in a police uniform they should just do all the nice person in the mask asks? So much for confidence in your police force. What would a white or Asian or black officer be told if they wanted to wear masks while enforcing laws? Toleration and political correctness will be the deaths of officers everywhere in the US and Canada. Welcome to Wally world.

Mark LaJoye @ 11/28/2013 6:09 AM

This is a concretive effort to push Sharia Law across North America and when you have the president like we have who is weak on Foreign Policy it's only a matter of time.

Ken Dusenberry @ 11/28/2013 6:27 AM

In all of my time as a policeman we were permitted to wear symbols of our religious beliefs, however they were required to be concealed when in uniform. Police officers, as representatives of the "State" were required to be religiously neutral, were not permitted to espouse one religion over another, and were expected to treat all persons equally. When I was working there were discussions about permitting persons to join the force whose religious beliefs required that they wear a beard, like the Sikhs. This was rejected because it was not anonymous, and because it would interfere with the wearing of the gas mask should it be required. Would wearing the Hijab interfere with wearing of the helmet, or other head gear?
Today they are requiring that officers conceal any tattoos that they may have, of any sort, so that no political ideology might be expressed.
Police officers are not religious spokespersons.

ali @ 11/28/2013 6:41 AM

Bible Verses regarding Head Covering

http://www.learningace.com/doc/6268805/92e666412999c1f0d6abb67ebc96d228/-hijab-in-the-bible-by-ahmed-deedat.

http://english.tebyan.net/newindex.aspx?pid=66066

CubsFan @ 11/28/2013 6:50 AM

It's called a UNIFORM. Live with it as it is or find another profession. What a joke.

Pat @ 11/28/2013 7:49 AM

The head gear is a statement from a culture that treats women as a lower class of citizens. They are property of their husbands. Any police force that aids in this treatment of woman should be ashamed of themselves, it's a step backwards.

Mike @ 11/28/2013 8:08 AM

Ali - the Bible predates the hijab nonsense by 600 years minimum. Your link is dead besides.

Dave @ 11/28/2013 8:07 AM

This is an easy one,,HELL NO!

Ken @ 11/28/2013 8:36 AM

WOW.....nothing like arming the enemy then allowing them to wear a hoodie. This is just senseless political correctness. BTW,..anyone else just hate the commercial you have to endure at the beginning of the story. Very frustrating for me. Wish Police Magazine would stop this.....

Ken @ 11/28/2013 8:44 AM

As a LEO with 43 years on the job, take it from me.....women have no place in a patrol car answering emergency calls. They just don't have the upper body strength and stamina to handle the drunks and crazies. Political correctness has allowed them to be placed in grave danger. I still can't understand why a female would want to place herself in that position. So, this debate about wearing a special head scarf in not surprising.

scott @ 11/28/2013 8:44 AM

political correctness run wild..if folks do not like the social norms and what the prescribed uniform is; too bad. It is time that the West starts being the West we are not the MidEast where this is accepted attire. This is breaking the uniformity of the department.

Leonard Mather @ 11/28/2013 9:30 AM

As a Forensic Psychologist I suggest that the Hijab practice NOT be approved. For the Administration, I suggest they read Sun Tzu's Art of War and pay heed to the statement: "You must know your enemy BETTER than he knows you. If not, HE will win." Islamists know us better and use our own laws, beliefs, political correctness to do what the Koran orders them to do, i.e., 1) not accept us as auliya (friends), 2) kill the Mushrikun (non-believers) as per Surah 9:5, 3) Surah 5:51 specifically names Jews and Christians who cannot be Auliya (friends), and 4) Surah 5:33 states that those against Allah shall be killed or crucified or their hands and feet cut off from opposite sides or be exiled. Allowing the hijab on Muslim LEOs is proof they are winning by insidious infiltration. It will be a matter of time before another Major Hasan pulls a Tsarnaev and becomes a Shaheen (martyr) getting 72 virgins in heaven. I suppose a female Shaheen gets 72 Studs.

Retired NY Boss @ 11/28/2013 9:34 AM

PC run amuck again.

Ken - I worked with a lot of women that i would trust to back me up in any situation.

ali @ 11/28/2013 9:40 AM

I'm a muslim police officer! What we need it to do our Job perfectly, with or without hijab! we must have good hearts!
Sorry !!!! You are all speaking about Islam as enemies!!!!!!!
Islam is the Peace , please try to read and Understand the Coran !
we respect all the religions and we understand the christianity from the bible and the jesus not from the christians !

Aaron @ 11/28/2013 9:50 AM

Fuck you and you Allah. Eat pork you piece of shit.

Capt. Crunch @ 11/28/2013 10:02 AM

What a bunch of BS, talk about bending over for the Muslims. This is so chicken shit.

Joseph @ 11/28/2013 10:07 AM

I would think that wearing a headscarf would not only interfere with any tactical movement by obviously obscuring your visibility, it could be used to strangle the female officer wearing it!!!! This may work for Canadian LE.....but would NEVER work for American LE!!!
Do you REALLY want to alienate the rest of your department by allowing one religion to be FORMALLY RECOGNIZED while shunning the rest? BAD IDEA!!!!!

Retired Chief @ 11/28/2013 10:38 AM

Sorry Ali but the facts are contrary to your assertion that Islam is a religion of peace. It is more a political ideology than a religion. The bible does not advocate killing those who are not Christian but your Kuran advocates Muslims killing all infidels (non believers). We need to learn from the experience in Europe where hordes of Muslims have taken over major cities (of course we are well on the way in the USA in some of our cities as well). Any "religion" that advocates the sort of violence Islam does and mistreats women should be banned from US law enforcement. I need to trust my fellow officers not worry about whether he or she is my enemy.

Ash @ 11/28/2013 10:59 AM

To Retired Chief and all others against Islam.. Are you guys kidding me? First of all "Retired Chief" I am not sure you ever were a chief if so you make chief's sound ignorant. Everything you just said is bs pulled from the media. You of all people should know not to believe the media. All people who claim Islam religion and kill in the name of it are Obviously not Muslim as they are contradicting the Koran. Islam is a religion of peace. There are a lot of idiots that make the religion look bad for many different reasons I won't go into as it would take too long. Whether the hijab gets approved or not I dont really care but all you haters sound ignorant. You are acting like the certain members of public who hate all cops because of a few bad ones that made it to the media! I am a Muslim who has red white and blue running in my veins. Shame on you.

Ash @ 11/28/2013 11:00 AM

I am a Muslim cop. Muslims are not the enemy!

Chad @ 11/28/2013 11:43 AM

Muslim and Christians in a room together and let them sort it out. It will be better the moment people stop buying into any religion.

Rushdi Cader @ 11/28/2013 11:49 AM

The hijab issue is at the individual description of every department, no different than facial hair and yamuke for our Jewish officers.

The response from a "Retired chief" is far more concerning. I too am a Muslim cop, and tactical physician and I find such comments about Islam and Muslims reprehensible and downright bigoted.

Are there bad people who are Muslim and use misanthropic interpretations of religion to justify mayhem - yes. But the same is true in every tradition.

As far as American Muslims standing up against "Mislam". See www.alert-us.org. We not only stand against radical "Mislam", we put ourselves on the front line. Yes that's my wife and kids in those pictures. We love our country and put ourselves at the forefront of its safety.

"Retired chief" if you had a pair of ovaries you would be open about who you are and put a name to your comments. Otherwise you are just another spineless bigot who is a disgrace to our men and women in blue!

Dr. Rushdi Cader MD, FACEP.

Nick @ 11/28/2013 2:29 PM

You conform to the job, the job does not conform to you. Go buy a halal cart and sell chicken with rice or get the f out!

HT @ 11/28/2013 2:44 PM

With all due respect. Don't come to my country and try to change our ways and culture. Keep that in your own country pls. When we go to the middle east we "Have to abide by thier lwas and culture". So do the same

Rushdi Cader @ 11/28/2013 3:21 PM

HT, Nick and all the other nameless bloggers who hide behind the anonymity of a pen name. Firstly, you clearly don't believe strongly enough in your words to put your name to them. So your opinions are as meaningless as graffiti scrawl on a toilet stall.

Secondly, it's not just your country, it's "our" country as well. This isn't Pakistan, Egypt or Burma where religious minorities "don't belong" and are mistreated and shunned. Our nation includes Jews, Muslims, and Orthodox Christians with their beards and seemingly "weird rituals", as well as Indians and Mexicans with our "Halal carts and Taco trucks". You may not like it but that's America.

Lastly, I would never fault a department for having a dress code, including officers shaving and not wearing a yalmuke or hijab. That said, I would not ridicule a department that elected to include or expand its dress code to accommodate Sikhs, Jews, or even the "dreaded" Moslem women.

In closing, to all you closet bigots choosing to smash on the Muslim American community, .... have even 1/1000 the courage of a Muslim American woman who chooses to wear a scarf in public, and put a name to your words - look in the mirror - only a coward throws stones and runs away! You guys are serious douchebags!

Anyway, I'm going to enjoy some Tandoori Turkey with my family... Happy Thanksgiving!

Dr. Cader

AusFost1 @ 11/28/2013 3:26 PM

Everything I was going to say is covered, except this. Leaving everything else aside, it's dangerous to have anything covering your head and restricting your vision on duty, and as someone else pointed out, can be used to strangle you. Has to be banned just purely on those grounds alone. End of argument. If you need to wear it, you can't be a police officer. Just how it is.

ian @ 11/28/2013 3:52 PM

It's a bad idea for officers to dress in a manner that identifies with any specific religion. Officers must look and behave neutral. Dressing in a manner that identifies with a specific religion invites all sorts of additional problems when dealing with a diverse public.

Steve Rothstein @ 11/28/2013 4:01 PM

I am both surprised and very disappointed at most of the responses to this issue. I cannot decide whether I am more embarrassed at the ignorance displayed here by supposed officers or by the bias displayed.

The first and most important point is that the hijab does not necessarily cover the face like a mask. In many cases, the hijab is just like a scarf that covers the hair and shoulders. Knowing exactly what we are talking about would be important to make valid statements.

Second is whether or not Islam is a peaceful religion. As a Jewish officer who is aware of history, I can tell you that Christianity has a pretty bloody history against non-believers also. Any religion can be twisted by some and it is the specific people, not the religion itself which is bad.

There are some valid points to be considered, including the tactical question of whether or not it restricts the officer and the state endorsement or display of a religion, as well as the concept of uniformity.

But lets keep the discussion to facts and factual issues. If a department would let me wear a yarmulke or a Christian wear a cross, I can see no reason not to allow a hijab. If I cannot wear other religious items, then the hijab can also be forbidden.

Rushdi Cader @ 11/28/2013 9:41 PM

Ian, Ofcr D, and the unnamed Jewish Ofcr all make good points. Hijab, as with other religious ornaments do make people stick out. It draws attention and can be a source of unnecessary conflict. For the reasons listed by the previous commentors, I'm not a proponent for a hijab uniform option for Muslim female LEO's. That being said, I wouldn't oppose it if a particular department allowed hijab for their employees.

But, these are not the only aspects that draw attention to particular officers.

I've seen black officers called "nigger" by drunk and belligerent suspects. Female officers are commonly the target of sexual innuendo or directed verbal abuse by dirtbags. We can't all change our color or our gender just to not stick out from the majority.

At the end of the day.. What really matters is that irrespective of religion, race, or physical features that every officer steps up firstly to protect the public and secondly to protect other officers.

The comments of some of the people in this blog makes me wonder if they would have the back of a fellow female, minority, or Muslim officer. Some of you need more than sensitivity training, you need to find another line of work. Especially concerning is a purported command level individual "retired chief" with such ugly and Islamophobic views. I'm glad to hear you are retired, as bigots shouldn't be making decisions about hiring and firing for any LE agency in the US.

This blog draws attention to the real issue of concern, not hijab or religious symbols, but rather bigotry, prejudice and discrimination towards minorities and Muslims within our LE community. Dr. Rushdi Cader M.D, F.A.C.E.P.

ali @ 11/29/2013 1:33 AM

for Retired Chief !
Islam is a religion of peace as the The bible . Sorry Islam does not advocate killing all infidels (non believers), Never. Try to read the coran and Understand the real meaning!
The acts of some muslims don't translate the real, meaning !
I understand christianity from bible , not from christians !
Some christians kill children, women and more !!!!
some I will never judge your religion ! the religion is very far from the acts of persons.

ali @ 11/29/2013 1:35 AM

What really matters is that irrespective of religion, race, or physical features that every officer steps up firstly to protect the public and secondly to protect other officers.

ali @ 11/29/2013 1:37 AM

Aaron , Sorry !!!!!! you are very dirty person and impolite person !
you must respect the others !

ali @ 11/29/2013 1:41 AM

Capt. Crunch
Sorry sir , what we need is to be good persons and we must respect all religions ! we are not talking about bending over for the Muslims.

A.D. @ 11/29/2013 2:11 AM

Greetings everyone. Reading through the comments I can immediatelly see that only few are possibly law enforceemnt officers, while all others are simply trolling around. I remember "Serpico" the first one who posted on this site from varous Islamic News based sites, such as Islam Online/On Islam...where he trolled around and spewed all kinds of hatred and intolerance, but only ran away when challenged to real and live debate against Abu Ahmed and Bosnian Muslim (pen names). As LEO we should be able to identify such persons who are here to start trouble and who bring nothing constructive.

And by the way, most responses if not all here are seeminly from US Americans and not Canadians(?) Why so? Are Canadians incapable of deciding for themselves? Maybe it's just the imperialistic mindset of some here who boast about freedoms yet they would lke to dictate who is going to wear what and how they are to see things? Interesting indeed

Majeed @ 11/29/2013 2:35 AM

I guess most of those commenting here are of the same profession, and in this case let me remind you that you have not beet trained to become philosophers, but to follow the chain of command and respect all the decisions taken by the hierarchy.

eodk9trainer @ 11/29/2013 4:01 AM

@Aaron---That comment of yours was uncalled for. I've worked with many Muslims with my current job. They have come here to the US to train with us and they have been nothing but true gentlemen with deep respect for the US and what we do for them. I'm opposed to this proposed policy change by Edmonton but I am not opposed to Muslims. They have their issues, just as we do, but they also have many good people in their ranks. I hope you're yanked from this site until you learn a little respect.

Nick @ 11/29/2013 6:34 AM

I reay hope that most of you are not LEOs. As an LEO myself, I'm glad I don't have racists, ignorant, and hateful people on my team. I've served in Iraq and Afghanistan if you've been there you know that most of the population is trying to make their county a better place, and are glad we are there

Nick @ 11/29/2013 6:37 AM

I really feel sorry for the citizens in their jurisdiction

TJiNY @ 11/29/2013 10:41 AM

Political correctness run amuck.

Forget officer safety, lets just continue to appease anyone who asks.

Everything that is done today isn't wrong.
Everything done today isn't racist.
Everyone who wants a job isn't entitled tot he job changing policy to accommodate them.

This is truly a self serving generation that has no understanding of society, or rules.

Capt. Crunch @ 11/29/2013 10:54 AM

@ Ali, you have to understand that a uniform is exactly what it is a uniform, which means you and your brother officers have to wear the same uniform and the same rule with female officers. When your in uniform you represent the Dept. and ALL the people in your community. Religion I.D. has no place in a police dept., no matter what religion it is. If a Muslim has to advertise their religion while being a police officer then maybe this is not the job for them.

ali @ 11/29/2013 12:28 PM

eodk9trainer
Many thanks sir, the same in my country, we respect all the religions

ali @ 11/29/2013 12:29 PM

Nick , many thanks for your comment

Sam Donalds @ 11/29/2013 12:34 PM

Is there any end to the endless sucking up to endlessly-demanding Islamic militants? Quite aside from the hazards of the hijab, it is demeaning for decent Americans to give in to demands that we endlessly accommodate Muslim demands instead of them learning to live as Americans. I only hope idiocy like this is cut short and not allowed to spread.

ali @ 11/29/2013 12:34 PM

@ Capt. Crunch
I'm agree with you sir, I'm a LEO, in my country all the women have the same uniform , I mean the muslim women work without hijab, after the duty , they wear the hijab!
we wear the same uniform and we have the same rule with female officers
But what we don't like when people say wrong words about Islam !
many thanks

Billy Sims @ 11/29/2013 12:37 PM

The Koran and other Islamic "holy books" teach that infidels (that's all of us non-Muslims, though Islam has a special hatred for Jews and Christians) should be slain, demeaned, enslaved, or forced to convert to Islam. This is also advocated by Islamic teachers. It is ridiculous that there is a trend toward accommodating even the most outrageous Muslim demands, rather than recognizing Islam for what it is: a religion of racism; a political movement of religious-based totalitarianism; and a threat to civilization.

Robert Gribbs @ 11/29/2013 12:39 PM

Canada has a long and sordid history of kowtowing to aggressive and selfish ethnic or religious groups. One of the most visible is allowing RCMP ("Mounties") to wear turbans instead of the traditional black flat brimmed "Dudley Dooright" hat. Apparently this profound Canadian gutlessness is metastasizing.

R. Cader @ 11/29/2013 10:45 PM

Billy Sims - you simply have your information wrong. Reading your comments is like an oxyclean commercial for Islamophobia. And no you are not an "infidel" - you are just poorly informed and spreading hate. The same radical "Mislamists" who would call you infidel and wish to cause you harm, are the same folks who would refer to people like me with the same term and wish me and my family dead!

Once again, I am Muslim. It is a choice of which I am proud. The Quran taught me "If you save one innocent life it's as if you have saved all of humanity, if you take an innocent life it is as if you have murdered all of humanity."

Over my career I've saved the lives of hundreds of Jews and Christians, and yes - it was motivated by Islam.

Rushdi

Dr. Rushdi Cader M.D., F.A.C.E.P.

R. Cader @ 11/29/2013 10:47 PM

Also, my wife is half Jewish and half Hindu. She is our SART director, and is an advocate for the most vulnerable children in our country. She wears hijab and she is an American hero!!!!

My children have Jewish blood running through their veins and yes, they too practice Islam. My youngest son wants to be a cop, and I've forwarded him this discussion so he knows the animosity, bigotry and discrimination that's out there towards us as Muslims within our Law Enforcement community. It's a fact, just as racism and anti-semitism were common within society in the early part of the last century. I share this with him to teach him to suck it up and serve his country and the community despite the hateful words of some.

I know as a fact that my brothers of all races and religions in the LE community have and will always have my back. The haters will gradually become extinct. In the meantime, Muslim Americans need to be like Jackie Robinson... 42!!!

Rushdi

Dr. Rushdi Cader M.D., F.A.C.E.P.

R. Cader @ 11/29/2013 10:51 PM

Also Robert re: "selfish" ethnic groups:

I started the first Muslim free clinic in the United States which to date has cared for over 30,000 Americans. I have traveled to several regions of conflict and natural disaster where I have represented both my faith and my country through service. You say we are selfish - "STEP OFF!!!" As a single American Muslim I have selflessly served more than what a 1000 of my American compatriots have done... How dare you level that accusation. We have given back and more!!!

Moreover, I would risk my life and the safety of our family to protect our nation, yet people like you & Billy Sims feel it necessary to spread animosity and hatred towards people like me, my wife and my kids. Why do you feel it so necessary to generalize the acts of a few radicals to a population of 7 million American Muslims?!!

Rushdi

Dr. Rushdi Cader M.D., F.A.C.E.P.

R. Cader @ 11/29/2013 10:54 PM

Unfortunately, some of you suffer from an illness that pushes you to spread malice and animosity towards minorities. This is not the way or teaching of Christ who taught, "love your brother like your own soul, and protect him like the pupil of your eye."

As far as being forced to convert or die - over 2 millennia this phenomenon has occurred by numerous extremist groups including Christians and Muslims, to the contrary of their religious teachings. Ask yourself what happened to the Jews of Cordoba or Aushwitz? Christianity cannot be blamed for the misdeeds of these so-called Christians, no more than modern Christians can be held accountable for the Hutaree Christian Militia or Anders Brevik.

Rushdi

Dr. Rushdi Cader M.D., F.A.C.E.P.

R. Cader @ 11/29/2013 10:59 PM

On the subject of freedom of choice and religious pluralism, the Quran reads, "let there be no compulsion in faith"... Also, if you look at the Achtiname of Muhammad, stored at St. Catherine's Monestary at Mt. Sinai, you may be surprised. The document was drafted in 628 and had the handprint of Muhammad. Google it... I've cared for the Christian monks who reside there.
Lastly, when we examine the challenges facing our nation, 15,000 murders per year, forcible rapes, aggravated assault, drugs and gangs - I would hardly place scarf wearing women at the top of our list of national law enforcement interest concerns. Especially when no one in our country has even suggested it!!! For those who are heated and angry about radicalized religion - focus your fury on those who deserve it, not upon innocent women from minority groups who choose to follow their faith by wearing a scarf.!!!

Rushdi

Dr. Rushdi Cader M.D., F.A.C.E.P.

Retired Chief @ 11/30/2013 6:57 AM

Not to belabor the point, and acknowledging the fact that there are Muslims who do not subscribe to all of the teachings in the Quran there is a FACT that underlies my position. The Quran contains no less than 109 exhortations for Muslims to do violence against "non-believers". Quran 2:191-193 is just one example.
My concern about hiring PRACTICING and BELIEVING Muslims in either the USA or Canada (both composed primarily of non-believers) is based upon what PRACTICING and BELIEVING Muslims are expected to do. Will we wind up with a Fort Hood incident in one of our police precincts? Would we knowingly hire a member of the KKK or the Aryan Brotherhood or the Black Panthers? I don't think so, at least I wouldn't. If a Muslim does not subscribe to the violence urging sections of the Quran then that person is not truly a Muslim and should denounce those teachings---in which case, all other requirements to become a cop having been met I would consider hiring such a person.

Retired Chief @ 11/30/2013 6:57 AM

Not to belabor the point, and acknowledging the fact that there are Muslims who do not subscribe to all of the teachings in the Quran there is a FACT that underlies my position. The Quran contains no less than 109 exhortations for Muslims to do violence against "non-believers". Quran 2:191-193 is just one example.
My concern about hiring PRACTICING and BELIEVING Muslims in either the USA or Canada (both composed primarily of non-believers) is based upon what PRACTICING and BELIEVING Muslims are expected to do. Will we wind up with a Fort Hood incident in one of our police precincts? Would we knowingly hire a member of the KKK or the Aryan Brotherhood or the Black Panthers? I don't think so, at least I wouldn't. If a Muslim does not subscribe to the violence urging sections of the Quran then that person is not truly a Muslim and should denounce those teachings---in which case, all other requirements to become a cop having been met I would consider hiring such a person.

R. Cader @ 11/30/2013 12:00 PM

With regard to violence in holy books there are clearly verses that can be interpreted violently in both the Quran and even moreso in the Bible (100's). What differentiates the violent radical from the peace loving practitioner in both Christianity and Islam is the interpretation that is taken from the verses. Anders and Awlaki obviously took the violent interpretation.

R. Cader @ 11/30/2013 12:01 PM

There is Islam, the religion of 1.6 billion followers of Abraham, and there is "Miss-lam" the misguided path of radical misanthropes and criminals. I would attest that radical extremists including AQ and it's followers are the true "infidels" and those of us on the side of goodness, law and order are the ones attempting to seek Gods favor and walk the straight path. Thankfully this represents the vast majority of Muslims worldwide.

R. Cader @ 11/30/2013 12:04 PM

"Retired chief" I'm by no means a saint: I overeat, and have a quick temper. But that said, I live by most of the precepts of Islam, I fast, I pray, I give charity, I serve my Christian neighbor (who quite frankly beats me out in his graciousness, generosity and kindness). I dont drink smoke or use intoxicants. I don't harm anyone. I feed the hungry and assist the poor and socially lost. We own a Rottweiler mix, Taliya, who we saved from the pound (yes some Muslims do own dogs) and my life is dedicated to saving lives and serving my brothers in blue. Moreover, every night Before I sleep I make sure my heart is not filled with malice towards another living soul (a Prophetic teaching). This is all motivated by my belief structure: Islam. The majority of Muslims who read this would classify me as both "Believing and Practicing". I'm not saying this to say I'm in any way holy. But I love God, seek His guidance and forgiveness, and try to be good to all men.

R. Cader @ 11/30/2013 12:11 PM

So I understand from your note that you would not hire me or other Muslims because we are "believing and practicing" Muslims. This is the prejudice & discrimination that I referred to previously. It is a damning testament by the "retired chief" of a US law enforcement agency. Unfortunately you are not the only one.

R. Cader @ 11/30/2013 12:15 PM

I will say this however, that the extremist followers of "Miss-lam" are convinced they are being "good" Muslims in their radical advocacy aimed at suppressing women's rights, apostasy laws, anti-semitic drivel and subscribing to a totalitarian form of religious law. My simple answer is that they are dead wrong... And we outnumber them many many thousands to one. And we will fight "Miss-lam" to the the very end.

Jihad goes both ways. The struggle of violent radicals is to harm. Ours is to protect and serve. I believe God is on our side!

At the close of the day, "retired chief" and other "Anti-Muslim" bigots. I blame the radical violent extremists for creating you. If the Muslim world were known for people like my wife, we wouldn't even be having this conversation.

Warner Richardson @ 11/30/2013 2:40 PM

@ R. Cader. I have been reading through the comments on this article and wow! People sure do get heated up about this issue. I have heard a lot of people saying that both Christianity and Islam are peacful and I have heard people say that both religions are violent. You said there are verses that "can be interpreted violently in both the Quran and even moreso in the Bible". What are some of the verses in the Quran and the Bible how have they been misinterpreted to be violent? I have read a few parts of the Quran and I found it hard to understand. I was hoping someone who is a Muslim could explain it to me.

Rushdi Cader @ 11/30/2013 5:11 PM

I didn't say that the Bible was interpreted more violently than the Quran. The converse may actually more true in certain parts of the world. I said there are more verses that could be interpreted and perceived as violent. I believe a study of both books would reveal this to be true. That said, interpretation and application is everything. We can clearly point to great sages in the Christian community like the monks of St. Catherine's who display the epitome of peace and goodness. They clearly interpret their holy books correctly. We can also examine backward and violent groups like the Taliban or Hisbul Tahrir and clearly view their behavior and advocacy as nothing short of barbaric and oppressive. The Prophet Muhammad taught, "People naturally love those who are kind, and loathe those who are cruel."

It is why as a Muslim I adore my brothers at St. Catherine's Monestary, and dispise Taliban criminals who attack school girls for seeking an education.

It's all about the interpretation and application of teachings. The discussion of specifics would be exhaustive. R. Cader.

plato's playdough @ 12/1/2013 3:37 AM

http://www.galaxyarmynavy.com/military-face-masks-p-264.asp - http://www.ebay.com/itm/like/200975538341?lpid=82 - http://www.ebay.com/itm/6-in-1-Thermal-Fleece-Balaclava-Hood-Police-Swat-Ski-Bike-Wind-Stopper-Face-Mask-/251269918902?_trksid=p2054897.l4276 - http://thehivedaily.com/blog/2011/02/01/police-state-usalaw-officer-wears-ski-mask-on-traffic-stops-in-houston-county-al/ - and now my comment: a hijab is not a niqab. If I never see another more obvious red-herring issue, i swear it'll be TOO SOON.

Just Dang... @ 12/1/2013 7:09 PM

I thought the whole idea of a "uniform" was to create equality by removing the charachteristics of the individual and creating a sense of unity recognized in like dressed first responders... Silly me. I can see this whole concept headed down the slippery slope post haste. What happens when a non- Muslim has to respond to a community only fixated on Muslim responders? Sounds like trying be diverse will become devisive. Seen it happen with Spanish speaking officers vs non Spanish speaking officers and white vs non-white officers.

Rushdi Cader @ 12/1/2013 11:24 PM

My issue in the responses on this posting has really been about the bigoted and prejudicial views of those who have submitted "veiled" responses. Back to the subject at hand, hijab and LE UNIFORM. There are a number of aspects that are incompatible with those who have a very conservative interpretation of their faith. This applies to Muslims, Jews, Sikhs, Christians and other faith groups. Facial hair for example is one issue. Also for very conservative Muslim women who wear hijab, they may not wish to shake hands with a man let alone take a male suspect to the ground when necessary. In truth most ultra conservative Muslim women would not apply to a PD for patrol duties. The issue is in my opinion a moot point.

The greater issue, as witnessed by these posts is bigotry, racism, prejudice and discrimination towards religious minorities within our own LE community.

Lt. Sal @ 12/2/2013 4:59 AM

Regardless of what religion you are, if you are going to be an officer, you must change and get in line with the uniform. Christians and those of the Jewish faith have for years worked their holy days and weekends to protect others. that is the nature of being a police officer or a soldier for that matter. There are no special days for us. They are work days. The uniform has changed over the years due to science and safety and comfort needs, but over all it has traditionally stayed the same and is recognized as a police officers uniform. Stay safe, Lt. Sal

Firecop @ 12/2/2013 5:19 AM

I am embarrassed to say I am a Canadian. These people come to Canada and the US to get away (it's called freedom) from their own country's restrictive laws, and then work to force all of us to live by them. And we have so many politicians and people in power who are stupid enough to go along with the minority opinion.......time to make some changes next election.

Lt Dan @ 12/2/2013 6:03 AM

The first thing being overlooked here is that Muslim women are stepping out of the shadows of sometimes oppressive males. If a woman who follows the Muslim faith is progressive enough and spirited enough to work as a police officer, SO BE IT and GOOD FOR HER. Let her enforce the CRIMINAL CODE.
So looking at the individual needs of a woman who wants to be effective, the head covering is tactically and operationally a VERY BAD idea. It was like a co-worker trying to explain to a rookie female officer that hoop earrings were not acceptable, she wanted to argue.
The big picture of creeping Sharia is for another topic.

Rushdi Cader @ 12/2/2013 12:23 PM

The dress code is the dress code, if it's not compatible, perhaps it's not the right job. As I mentioned, not being able to wear hijab would be only the tip of the iceberg in terms of incompatibility for a conservative hijab wearing woman doing hands on police work. This is not to say their is anything wrong with being a conservative American hijab wearing woman. Essentially all Muslim women who become cops working in the field dont wear hijab, and this does not mean they are not "practicing and believing", no more than a Jew who doesn't wear a yalmuke at work looses his personal religious identity. The conservative Jewish cop friends I know don't wear a beard or a yalmuke at work, and they retain their Jewishness. I think most everyone agrees with this, Jews, Muslims, and Christians. What people wear at home or at their place of worship is entirely their own decision.

What is important here, is not to turn a Canadian dress code decision into a hate fest towards an already defamed minority religious community here in the US. I can't underscore this enough. This animosity has accelerated in recent years and it's far from healthy, especially for command level personnel (like Lt's and Chiefs) who are supposed to be an example to their departments.

Now for the really pressing dress code conundrum - what if a Sri Lankan American cop wants to wear a kilt on duty- or as I call it "a tactical sarong" ??? ; ) ... My argument is that it prevents hyperthermia in hot environments - (I am joking btw before anyone decides to smash on Sri Lankan Americans and their creeping curry).

Richard Hightower @ 12/2/2013 12:37 PM

This is DISGUSTING -- if these people cannot aclimate to Candadian / American culture and society, they sould LEAVE. We don't need them -- we don't want them -- and we sure as HECK don't want their backward and degrading culture fixtures impacting us here.

Rushdi Cader @ 12/2/2013 1:31 PM

Richard, what's disgusting is your intolerance for your countrymen of another tradition.

American Muslims are part of the fabric of this great nation. We aren't going anywhere. If you don't like it maybe you should leave.

By the way, I loved your performance in Police Academy 1,2, & 3.

R.

Lenny @ 12/2/2013 4:49 PM

WOW, don't know where to start.
So much ignorance, racism and hatred over such a trivial point.
First, in my opinion all religions are simply a means of control
and the best money making scams ever. More lives have been lost
to religion than anything else. The levels of savagery are far more
evident when someone believes they are fighting for their "god".
If you wish to be truly entertained just listen to the ignorance, irony
and hypocrisy that usually follows "well I'm a christian and I believe".
To Dr. Cader thanks for commenting but as you can see most on here
simply don't like it when you disagree with them. You have made some wonderful points, but most North American cops are racist(75 comments and counting) and will alwaysbe. R Hightower why not go onto a native reserve and try to repeat your comments with a straight face.

Rushdi Cader @ 12/2/2013 5:06 PM

Lenny I respectfully disagree. ALL of the cops I know are the bravest and most honorable people I know. They put up with a lot abuse for the sake of protecting lives and property. We run towards danger and personal risk when others are running out. Don't let the comments in this blog make you think any less of our LE community. TO BE HONEST, I DOUBT SOME ARE EVEN COPS! There are a few people in every group who don't represent us well. Just like radicals in the Muslim community, mean spirited people in LE are few and far between. It's usually the big mouths who get the microphone.

plato's playdough @ 12/3/2013 3:28 AM

Here was the first thing you could have noted. " Natasha Goudar with the Equity, Diversity and Human Rights Unit said the conversation started when a recruiter was asked if EPS would ever even consider allowing someone to wear a hijab."

Natasha Goudar
Manager, Equity, Diversity and Human Rights at Edmonton Police Service

Here she is on LinkedIN_
http://www.linkedin.com/pub/natasha-goudar/61/737/164

On Nov 25, two days before publication of this article we are commenting on, the Huffing Post Alberta had already published an article saying they WILL UNVEIL 2 hijab options. See link below.
http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2013/11/25/edmonton-police-hijab_n_4338342.html

As I said before, this is a red-herring issue. The article doesn't say if it IS or IS NOT for field use. EPD clearly brought Natasha Goudar in for a reason, given her bio on LinkedIN. Perhaps EPD would like to find Arabic speaking candidates to work the Arabic speaking areas.

Hijab or Balaclava, anyone?

plato's playdough @ 12/3/2013 3:48 AM

This just in.

In a effort to recruit more blatantly homosexual officers, new leather trousers with buttock cut-outs are being considered by the YRUgay community leadership for their community police force.

The mayor of YRUgay, Max Priapus, has expressed in the past that he feels local police have not done enough to accommodate the preferences of its most desirable demographic within its community.

Mayor Priapus also relates that he may later choose to expand the Uniform Code to allow multiple face-piercings if recruitment goals are not met after implementation of the leather cheekless chaps inducement.

S.S. @ 12/3/2013 11:03 AM

Go Back where you came from if you want to wear the towel around your head. Well it's in Canada. What do you expect. Canada has no balls, whatsoever. I can't believe they're actually considering this b.s.

Rushdi Cader @ 12/3/2013 12:23 PM

Well, i guess S.S.'s comment says it all. I'm signing off on this discussion, as my contribution only seems to bring out more ugliness, hostility, and malice towards innocent and good people.

I will leave you with a story of Christ from our tradition: Jesus was walking with Simon. A man they passed cursed Jesus. Jesus in turn blessed the man. The man again cursed Jesus, and again Jesus blessed him. Finally Simon turned to Jesus and said, "My lord, why do you bless this man that continues to curse you.?" Jesus responded, "We simply bring out that which we have within."

Blessings to all of you on this post. Stay safe, and may God grant you Peace and Love to your fellow man.

Rushdi.

Dr. Rushdi Cader, M.D., F.A.C.E.P.

Rushdi Cader @ 12/3/2013 2:36 PM

Oh - one last thing. To Muslims and Arab Americans seeking to be a part of Federal or Local LE, don't be detracted by the knucklehead comments in this series of posts. If you take a look at police mag posts going back some years you will realize that most of the folks posting are not legitimate people in the LE community: or they are retired lazy boy jockeys with nothing to do but make "non-PC" comments. Your LE agencies want you guys involved to protect, serve, and be part of Americas front line. All LE agencies have strict non-discrimination policies: re: race and religion. That's part of what frustrates bigots. Muslim Americans you are the solution to crushing radicalized Islam and indemnifying your faith from the actions of extremists! A career in LE is an awesome way to go, and there are many exciting paths from local LE, to DEA, HLS, FBI, CIA etc. Don't let anyone bully you or make you think otherwise! I went into LE because of the brotherhood and mutual support we have for one another. My experiences of being embraced and backed run entirely contrary to the "go back to Kazakhstan .. Wah wah wah" comments. Peace, Med1 Out!

therookie @ 12/4/2013 12:26 PM

Rushdi, the name says it all. You must be a closet Muslim like your Allah Akbar President. Do you subscribe to the, "Can't we all just get along." Rodney King phrase? Again, if you don't like the American way of life, move to a country that is Muslim. Don't come treading on my water, and expect to create waves without any splash back.

Rushdi Cader @ 12/8/2013 12:21 PM

Yes you hit the nail on the head, I am Muslim, and I hope i live up to my name. The meaning of the name Rushdi, means "one on the path of goodness". It's a Muslim name that was chosen for me by my Buddhist mother.

The source of these harsh sentiments is anger. If the aforementioned teachings of Christ don't touch your heart then consider this pearl from the "bodi sattue".

"Holding onto anger is like drinking poison and expecting the other person to die" Buddha

Peace, Rushdi

Lt Dan @ 12/10/2013 8:38 AM

A little more info has come out. There are no Muslim Female Officers in Edmonton. That makes this whole event rather silly and clearly indicates a progressive muslim agenda. I hope the first trailblazing female muslim officer will shed the hajib in favor of complying with traditional unform requirements. If she was my rookie, I would tell her to do so to avoid safety and behavioral concerns during citizen contacts. If she didn't do it, I would pass her of to another for training becase she didn't listen to me.

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