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Calif. Police Not Guilty in Death of Homeless Schizophrenic Man

January 13, 2014  | 

An Orange County jury Monday found two former Fullerton (Calif.) PD police officers accused of killing a schizophrenic homeless man, Kelly Thomas, not guilty, reports the L.A. Times.

Manuel Ramos and Jay Cicinelli were charged with striking Kelly Thomas with a baton and a stun gun in a beating that left him comatose. He died five days later.

Ramos' attorney, John Barnett, told reporters: "These peace officers were doing their jobs...they did what they were trained to do."

Orange County Dist. Atty. Tony Rackauckas said prosecutors would not pursue charges against a third Fullerton officer accused in the Thomas case. That officer's trial was pending.


Verdict in Murder Trial for Ex Calif. Officers May Hinge on Grainy Video

New Video of Fullerton Beating Shown In Court

Comments (42)

Displaying 1 - 42 of 42

Retired Chief @ 1/13/2014 5:38 PM

Some mistakes were made but this (like the Trayvon Martin-George Zimmerman case) was politically motivated. The DA (who hadn't tried a case in court since 1999) personally handled it. Under the California Penal Code the elements of the crimes they were charged with were certainly not there and like with Zimmerman the jury saw through it. Wonder if the officers will sue to get their jobs back?

Retired Chief @ 1/13/2014 5:38 PM

Some mistakes were made but this (like the Trayvon Martin-George Zimmerman case) was politically motivated. The DA (who hadn't tried a case in court since 1999) personally handled it. Under the California Penal Code the elements of the crimes they were charged with were certainly not there and like with Zimmerman the jury saw through it. Wonder if the officers will sue to get their jobs back?

Lenny @ 1/13/2014 6:43 PM

I don't think I have ever been more saddened and demoralized as I was today.
Kelly Thomas died five days after recieving a savage beating by members of
a brutal and unsupervised gang, but he died again today.
He died of brutality, sadism, and indifference all for the crime of being homeless.
I guess the only thing to do is to embrace the police motto "it's better to be tried by
12 than carried by 6", when dealing with members of this gang.

Pup @ 1/13/2014 9:11 PM

Lenny, you're such an idiot. Before you start sounding off and saying a load of crap, get the facts, attend the trail and mot of all, get a job.....It's time for you to choose another country to live in...see yaa!!!

Justice @ 1/13/2014 9:58 PM

Cry a river of tears, Democrats and your "progressive" allies in the war on Weatern civilization. The liberal establishment in America is bound and determined to drive a wedge between LE and the general law abiding public.

Mr. Thomas was a criminal. He was not an innocent person. He was breaking into cars, attempted to evade arrest and resisted. The officers may have employed deficient tactics, but their conduct was objectively reasonable. If you don't fight with Police conducting their lawful duties, they will NEVER hurt you. All of these incidents start and end with unlawful, illegal resistance.

If you can't understand that, Google "Graham v. Connor."

The Police are a thin, almost transparent line that keeps the homeless, vandals and sociopathic wretches from assailing your loved ones and impinging on your safety. Impugn them at your peril, for they may not always be there.

kevcop @ 1/14/2014 5:15 AM

I agree with Pup and Justice, Lenny you are either a non cop Democrat Liberial or a fool. I don't know the facts of the case since I'm in AZ, I suspect that the jury are the ones who made the right decision since they did hear the facts (or as many "facts" as they were allowed) I would suspect that yopu were upset with the Zimmerman & Rodney King verdicts as well and overjoyed at the O.J. verdict in LA. Face it you have your head on wrong and have taken the Liberal "all cops are not to be trusted" mind set. I don't say that you should leave your country as Pup does, but perhaps if you EVER were a victim you would appreciate the police for what they do. Grow up.

Arby @ 1/14/2014 5:44 AM

I agree with "Justice." If you don't fight the police, the police won't hurt you. I won't say "never" because there are some who should not be on the job, but you can say "rarely." If you think the cops are wrong, you're entitled to your opinion. Simply follow their commands and if they really are wrong, you have civil remedies (read that as "money"), that you can pursue without having to do it from a hospital bed or have your surviving relatives do it on your behalf. If you're wrong at least you can find that out in court in good health. That's what civil remedies are for - so you don't fight it out in the streets like schoolyard thugs. Get a grip, grow up and think it through.

Arby @ 1/14/2014 5:51 AM

...and one more thing. I've never had a homeless schizophrenic who was about to be arrested say to me, "I want you to know I am homeless and have been diagnosed as schizophrenic so if I start to resist or try to hurt you, please be understanding of my plight and don't hurt me." If they ever do, that would be interesting, but I would still do whatever I had to do to take them to jail. The goal is for neither one of us to be hurt, but failing that the fall back position is I don't get hurt and the suspect hurts until they stop.

Lenny @ 1/14/2014 5:56 AM

"The goal is for neither one of us to be hurt, but failing that the fall back position is I don't get hurt and the suspect hurts until they stop".

Or in this case until they stop breathing.

Arby @ 1/14/2014 6:35 AM

He was breathing and made it to the hospital, Lenny. Did you even see the video. When was he going to cooperate and give them his hands? As stated before, the jury saw it all and heard it all and made the decision they made. I honestly can't say in all INFORMED certainty that the methods they used were completely justfied, any more than you can say in all INFORMED certainty that they weren't. But the jury WAS informed and that was their decision. We've all seen innocent people go to jail and guilty people go free. Any human system will be flawed to some degree. I truly believe ours works best and is most often correct. I'll stand by the jury on this one and you can stand wherever you want to. It is what it is...

Longarm @ 1/14/2014 6:44 AM

Lenny, you're a complete asshat. Next time you get yourself in trouble, try calling a crack head for help and see how far that gets you.

Lenny @ 1/14/2014 7:03 AM

Yes I know he was breathing & made it to the hospital and existed for 5 days before his life support was turned off. & yes I have seen the video, I have followed this case very closely since it was first reported. The point I was making was about the savagery of police in general, & their most recent tenet of providing permanent solutions to temporary problems. If you can't say that the methods they used weren't justified it's simply because of your(and every other cops) inabilty to see things as they are if another cop is involved. And I weep for society. @Justice You're just simply a retard. @Pup I put in my 43 years, and I did find a countryt it's called Canada you may have heard of it, get a map look where you are and then look up unless you're in Alaska. @Kevcop I have made it very clear I'm not a cop never found the need to beat & terrorize people and the bitch about how tough my job is. Thanks for calling me a liberal, you probably haven't noticed but the word liberty is looming

Lenny @ 1/14/2014 7:07 AM

@ Longarm

Typical response from a bad mannered, ill tempered lackwit.
Go gnaw on some pork rinds, and watch Hannnity.
If I get myself in trouble I deal with it myself.
Calling 911 is one of the most dangerous things a person can
do these days.

Mike @ 1/14/2014 7:10 AM

Lenny is a tool

Lenny @ 1/14/2014 7:25 AM

@ Mike

Typical response from a bad mannered, ill tempered lackwit.
Go gnaw on some pork rinds, and watch Hannnity.
I see your thoughts are as thought out cogent and germane
as always.

Here is something Dr. Suess said

'The more that you read,
the more things you will know.
The more that you learn,
the more places you'll go.'

Isn't that interesting sweetheart.

Mike @ 1/14/2014 7:50 AM

Did I hurt little Lenny's feelings :( You're still a TOOL!

S.S. @ 1/14/2014 8:02 AM

Just in case you all didn't know lenny is a canadian, so therefore he's got no idea what the hell is going on in the U.S. He knows we all think he is a douchebag, and he reminds me of Buffalo Bill from silence of the lambs, cause all this guy does is sit in his mommy's basement and dance in women's clothing, and think of stupid shit to say. He does have a tendency to press some buttons on L.E.,and he knows what he's doing. He's under the impression that what he says is funny, but to us it's not a joke. All this I tried explaining to him , but lenny doesn't understand.I think he just does it to get attention since lenny has no girlfriend or boyfriend, and likes to dress and dance in women's clothing. Also lenny is really sensitive about his upbringing or lack thereof by his mommy and daddy.

S.S. @ 1/14/2014 8:33 AM

That's it bill... I mean lenny. So enlighten all of us. Tell us what you do, besides from being a burden to your country. Im pretty sure I got it right on the head, as far as what you are and do. Didn't your mommy ever teach you anything? To me you just come across like a worthless p.o.s. and a coward. All you can do is slam law enforcement for what we do, but you don't have the balls to step up and do something about it. Instead you sit in your mommys basement in your mommy's clothes and bitch about what it is we do. You're really pathetic. I wonder what your mommy think about you if she were to see you now. My guess is that she would be sickened at what a coward she raised. Well lenny or bill or whatever your name is I'll let you go so you can go dance in your mommy's dresses in your sad little basement.

Lenny @ 1/14/2014 8:48 AM

I've already mentioned what I do, I even mentioned it a few posts back on this very story when I was responding to ASSHAT(longarm) I'M RETIRED. I put in my 43 but I also kept a % one of the companies I cofounded. Are you finally starting to get a sense of my age yet? You guys should really learn to keep your snap judgements made while angry to yourselves. That's how innocent people get hurt by cops. And just what would you like me to do about it? Should I come and see you down in Texas? Perhaps a visit to USAT? Keep trying sweetheart, you know being "highly decorated and all".

John R. @ 1/14/2014 8:53 AM

So all you JACK THUGS stick up for each other and think you will all get the glory when that big confrontation day comes in USA? ; well sorry to disappoint you all.
People will remember the murderous, evil deeds you have done and somehow this will come back to you 10 fold. I like to think of the situation in The Walking Dead and how many bad things happen to RICK the cops..perhaps this will be your fate in the doomsday scenario that happens one day in America and then you will remember how you inflicted all the pain and sadism upon your fellow Americans and your prison will be forever not 20 or 30 years but till you die, in this country either by suicide or some gang beats you to death GESTAPO and nobody will give a rat's A@@ about you dying in some street or ditch? Just remember you will be stuck in the USA no matter what along with YOUR FAMILY MEMBERS and all the hate will be around you day and night.

Mike @ 1/14/2014 9:06 AM

John R..........Wow, I didn't know you got that much "computer time" in that mental institution you are staying in. You're lucky. Now, you and Lenny should shut up before I beat you both like schizophrenic homeless men.

S.S. @ 1/14/2014 9:13 AM

I would love for you to do that. But like I said before I know you don't have the balls bill..i mean lenny. I think your mommy took those too, along with any type of courage that you may have had. Since it sounds like your daddy was never around to raise you. It just amazes me to see how someone like yourself could even live with yourself. I've got to say that you aren't even ashamed of what you are, which is a coward. You put down the officers that are out there fighting for what's right and all you can do is put 'em down. Wow you must be really proud of yourself cause your standing up to THE MAN.

Lenny @ 1/14/2014 9:21 AM

No mike, use your words sweetheart, or you may end up in court.
As long as you ASSHATS keep insulting me I'll keep
taking you out of the park.

Lenny @ 1/14/2014 9:27 AM

When dealing with cops I've never sensed that I'm dealing with a man.
I'm not the one who chose a career that allows me to wear my manhood
on a belt. You really should seek help for your anger issues "being highly decorated and all"

Mike @ 1/14/2014 9:35 AM

Lenny................Is that what your doing, "taking me out of the park"? No thanks Lenny, I don't have time to play in the park with you. I have to get back to locking up bad guys. Something you have no idea about. Later Tool!

Lenny @ 1/14/2014 9:38 AM

@ Mike
Keep trying sweetheart. That was actually close to witty.

Lenny @ 1/14/2014 9:50 AM

Glad to hear the Feds will at least have a look at this.

News Flash Curtis Reeves, America's latest moviegoer/gun enthusiast/cop has uttered the magic phrase "I was in fear of being attacked" and being as he was once in law enforcement will soon be going home scott free.

S.S. @ 1/14/2014 10:54 AM

Work on some new material bill...i mean lenny. Why don't you get your mommy to help you. Oh...wait I forgot.

lenny @ 1/14/2014 11:06 AM

My material is always new, it's topical. Do you see how that works sweetheart?
Speaking of getting new material the mommy and bill stuff is not only getting the response from me you're hoping for, it's really getting old an tired.
But you keep on trying "being highly decorated and all".

Johnny Law @ 1/14/2014 11:12 AM

Brother officers, ignore Lenny and his stupid arm chair quarterback comments. He has never been a cop and never will be! He is a typical wannabe who bashes the police and everything they do, but will be the first to cry for help when the bad man shows up at his home. Same as the people who bash our military but have never been in harms way! Their comments mean nothing because they have never done the job. Stay safe BLUE!!

Jelly @ 1/14/2014 11:46 AM

Johnny Law……………I couldn’t agree with you more. Never, never, never argue with a liberal because they just don’t understand commonsense.

Capt. Crunch @ 1/14/2014 11:48 AM

This case went well, the police did their job and the courts did there job all went well. The parents of Thomas, do not realize yet but the police not only did society a favor but did the Thomas family a favor. We have to many dangerous people on the streets today.

Lenny @ 1/14/2014 11:09 PM

@ Capt Crunch
That's just perfect!!
Not only are you saying that Manuel Ramos and Jay Cicinelli killed Kelly Thomas, you also state your belief in eugenics. Did they have a psych profile you had to do or did you just show up with a gun and a bad attitude. I should imagine your le hero would be someone like Lawrence A. Rainey.

S.S. @ 1/15/2014 6:45 AM

Johnny law you have a great point. Nobody on this site likes or agrees with anything this d.b. has to say. He is nothing but a coward, and a loser with serious mommy issues. But hey the officers went through the process of going through the legal system and they won. The media only reports what they want and they make no mention of this guys criminal history or what he was doing prior. lenny the d.b. im sure only saw what he wanted. So who really cares what he thinks. The guy is a complete loser, who sits in his basement, rubs peanut butter on himself and thinks of his mommy. A clear product of liberal inbreeding. But so be it. Atleast he's not a U.S. citizen and is canada's problem.

Blue Knight @ 1/15/2014 7:10 AM

I have been reading all of the responses to this story. I am a LE Officer in south Texas and I just have to say if you have never been in the possition of dealing with a potential threat as a officer then how can you say what you may do. Put on a police uniform and get into the business of protecting you community, then you can have a say in how its done. I have made tough decisions in my line of work and I plan on going home after my shift every day. To my fellow officers I say don't let people that don't really know the job get you upset. You have to protect them to. "Ever Vigilant"

S.S. @ 1/15/2014 9:51 AM

Blue Knight has another great point and something that most of us have thought and do agree with it. We all know this is a thankless job, and we're only welcome when people need us. Almost nobody wants an officer there when things are fine and there aren't any problems, but when shit hits the fan they thank God that we are there. These other cowards such as lenny and john r. are the losers who think this way. Lets just hope they don't pro-create or if they do they stay in canada. Gow willing. In the mean time to all L.E.O.'S stay alert, watch your backs and may God be with you.

Hatred of the coward Gest @ 1/15/2014 10:35 AM

Pretty F###ing sad when this many Men brutalize one man for their own satisfaction and pleasure? --just hope and pray like I said before this happens again but this time gangs of MARATRUCHA or Mexican Mafia are close by as one of their own gets beat and then well it;s lights out for low life scum like this ?

S.S. @ 1/15/2014 10:52 AM

Another dumb ass and clearly states it as hatred fo the coward Guest. This dumbass was one that probably got only the verdict and saw only what the media wanted him to see. Based on that B.S. he came up with in his brilliant post. Look you moron you saw only a small part of what occurred, and not everything. You didn't see what this offender was like, and the type of person he was. He was an ANIMAL period!!!! Oh yeah and btw its Varrio Mara Salvatrucha or MS-13 dumb shit. Next time you have a problem and you need help call them and don't waste our time calling us Di**head!!!.

Pup @ 1/15/2014 2:13 PM

@Lenny, I'm glad you finally found a country to live in. Therefore, you should worry about Canada and not what happens in the USA. If you happen to know where the USA is, look it up on the map. You do know what a map is and how to read a map, don't you?
As for your 43 years, I was talking about you having a job, not being in prison. If you really followed the incident and trial, you would realize you don't get all the facts from the media. Media just reports what they want to in order to get ratings. You need to be in the court room to get all the facts. This is why we call it a jury trail. Have you ever asked yourself why people riot and hate cops? It's because of the news media provides negative press even when they don't have all the facts. The media has no idea what started the incident, they only see the conclusion. So Lenny, you're even a bigger idiot for portraying to be perfect. See you in hell!

Mark Anderson @ 1/18/2014 7:24 AM

That there are police officers commenting on this forum actually defending what happened is horrifying. The citizens of Fullerton are rightfully upset about this. You don't attack the face. And, more importantly, if that was anybody other than cops doing that same thing to that man, they would probably have received the death penalty, which is exactly what those six officers involved in this deserve.

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John R., you quote WALKING DEAD? ha, ha! Thanks for making me smile.

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