RE: How do you feel about professional courtesy?

I would complain to the Trooper's lieutenant about his attitude. Other people he stops will attribute his attitude not only to him, but to all law enforcement officers. Him chewing you out in front of your family was uncalled for and the obviously sarcastic "have a nice day now" was completely out of line. If he treats others like this he will eventually find himself in a physical altercation started by him running off at the mouth. Not everyone will remain respectful and calm like you did (I was also once in this situation, but it was a city officer and I never identified myself as an officer, I too remained calm while he made an ass of himself).
I dont think it should matter that you are a law enforcement officer or not, you should be treated the same as anyone else who gets stopped, but that trooper obviously needs to take a course on professional communication skills.

RE: How do you feel about professional courtesy?

I have to correct something about your question on this post. I do not see this as a matter of professional courtesy, but as a matter of just professionalism. His behavior was wrong no matter if you were an officer or not.

I have big problems with him chewing you or anyone else out. As a police officer, we have a job that gives us certain authorities. One of the things we get is officer discretion. We get to decide if we are going to file a charge or not in most cases. We do not have the authority to take any corrective action other than giving a warning or a citation. We do not have the authority to chew someone out no matter who it is or what we decided to do with the charge. Our job requires us to remain cool, calm, and polite to people. I strongly encourage officers to keep this in mind. We should use the seven step approach on traffic stops, and take whichever action we feel appropriate that we have the authority to take.

I also recommend that anytime an officer is rude we should call the complaint in. It may be too late for this incident now, but it might not. If you call the LT, he may still be able to get the car video of the incident and see how the officer behaved. The only way the agency will know how he behaves is if we call in the complaints. The only way the public will have faith in us is if they know we do police our own too.

As to the matter of professional courtesy, if youa re asking about the ticket versus a warning, I feel that this is entirely up to the officer writing the ticket. I have given and received this courtesy, and also been denied it. The officer's job is to take the action he feels appropriate to correct your illegal behavior. Some do not give officers a break because we should know better (which is true). Others give a break because they feel a kinship due to our jobs. It is their choice.

RE: How do you feel about professional courtesy?

Steve, I agree with you.

Usually, officers seem to feel that they only owe politeness to certain individuals. When I was falsely arrested and suffered verbal abuse from cops there was no where to go to complain, no listening ear. Its interesting to see how officers feel when they suffer emotional abuse from other officers! Ha!

Professionalism vs professional courtesy

All people must be treated the same. I can honestly say I am proud of the conduct of officers I work with after seeing them apprehend the man who killed the first of two officers we lost last year. The news was watching. I also know that the treatment of that man is the same treatment a speeder would receive. Always remain professional no matter the situation.

As for a cop speeding... I am angry when another law enforcement officer puts me in a position where I have to decide whether to take enforcement action or not. I have often politely told the officer that I am disappointed with them then let the go on their way. Usually a comment like, "I wish you had not put me in this position," is enough.

I have a belief that writing a ticket to someone who may save my life is wrong, but I don't have to like being put in the position to make that decision. Please keep in mind that people watch you on and off duty. Lead by example and remain true to your oaths. Thanks to all who serve selflessly.

2-way street

Professional courtesy is a two-way street.  In 19 years on the job, I've never been pulled over by a brother or sister officer.  Since I know the law, I have no excuse for violating it.  On the other hand, I wouldn't appreciate being "lectured" about the law by another officer, just as I don't lecture officers that I stop.  I just verify their ID and send them on their way.  Would I ever cite a fellow officer?  You bet.  Attitude is everything, especially from the motoring public.  Some people, officers or citizens, just beg for a citation.

Last edited @ 8/4/2007 10:59 AM

RE: How do you feel about professional courtesy?

I have to agree with pretty much everything the others have said. As you described it, his attitude was definately a problem. One question I do have is why did you use his name, and so often? His name is really meaningless to the story, yet you used it 7 times in a 10 line paragraph. Were you hoping one of his supervisors reads the forums?

The best thing would be to just contact his supervisor. Well, actually the second best...the best thing would have been to not have placed him in the position of having to pull you over.

Management systems...

This incident reminds me of something...in my PPCT class we were given a "Resistance Control Continuum" chart explaining the levels of force appropriate for officer to use when presented with different levels of resistance. Ya'll know what I am talking about.

Wouldn't the same thing apply to "verbal force"? The answer is "yes".Here's what I mean...the off-duty cop was calm and collected, and understood that he broke the law and since we aren't above the law, he knew that he could face getting slapped with a ticket, but still...he kept his attitude in check. His "verbal resistance" was pretty much non-existant.

The only thing I can think of is the on-duty officer must of been having a real bad day because he shouldn't of raised his level of "verbal control" because he wasn't met with any verbal resistance. The ticket we all know is not out of the question because yeah...usually cops allow 5 to 7 over the speed limit...11 mph over is just not being safe. Some LEOs get real mad at others for being a bad example. The Blue Code of Silence is stronger in different areas of the country than others. And there are cops that are just plain assholes to their fellow cops which I could never understand that logic since we rely on each other to cover each other's backs. I would of conducted the traffic stop differently.

We all have the right in expressing our opinion. We have a right to complain about how our tax dollars are spent and what type of service we pay for. We have a right to express our views about a person to learn from one another - just like iron sharpens iron. A person is responsible for their own reputation and has the right to project their image however they wish. We have a right to bring against a person complaints regarding their behavior against or for their fellow man.

Last edited @ 8/9/2007 9:53 AM

RE: How do you feel about professional courtesy?

Professional courtesy, I have been on both sides of a traffic stop. On the side of the of stopping an LEO, I have had both the humble repectful off duty LEO and the hostile bitter off LEO.

When stopping Officer Respectful, I give them the upmost professional courtesy, I extend my self as far I can, unless of course it involves more than a traffic violation, then I extend myself as far as I legally can, without compromising integrity.

When Officer Bitter is stopped I evaluate the total situation, treat him with the courtesy I treat all persons I stop, up until the point where Officer Bitter decides to try to break my shoes as far as he/she can, that is when courtesy ends and dutiful enforcement brgins. It is the point when the offending officer talks his/her way into me writting them for the violation. At this point in my 30 years on the job, I have written one violation for an Officer, because he talked me into giving him the summons.

I have been stopped on several ocassions, I have treated the stopping Officers with respect, I have been given respect and professional courtesy in exhange. On one occasion professional courtesy, came with a stern lecture and the dropping of my paper work on the ground as the stopping Officer walked away and going back to his patrol car and peeling out, at that point I felt angry and very disapointed in the actions of this Officer, I could have called his command or made an internal complaint, but, I did not.

About 2 years later I was called to traffic stop as a supervisor, because it is the procedure when a offender is about to be placed in custody. Much to my surprise, it was the Officer who had stopped me that was being arrested for DUI. The arresting Officer did not know that the offender is also an Officer, since he would not produce ID of any sort. When the arresting officer found out, he asked if we should extend him professional courtesy, I asked him if the offender extended him professional courtesy by cooperating? Of couse the answer was no, the arrest was processed in the normal manner.

RE: How do you feel about professional courtesy?

I have given verbal warnings in lieu of enforcement action to both officers and their family members. I do the same for the regular joe on the street. However, you just know when some one needs a citation and when they do not. I've written family members of law enforcement officers but fortunately never needed to write an officer. Warning's have always worked. I was stopped a year ago for a bone headed move I made out in Washington State. I've been stopped 4 times my whole life and I'm 50. A deputy stopped me for crossing a white line going out of a left hand turn lane into lane two. No traffic there...but he saw me. I actually did not purposely do it. I had just turned out of a restaurant and tried to merge to get back onto the freeway entrance ramp. When he stopped me, I didn't know what the stop was for and asked him what I did. He said what do you mean.....you crossed the white line. I took my license out and gave him the rental car paperwork. He saw my badge and asked where I worked and he told me "shame on you...you should know better". I didn't say a thing...I guessed I was embarrased for driving with apparent head up ***. Anyway he told me "please don't do this again" and gave me my stuff back after looking at my ID. I thanked him and I was on my way.

He got his point across and I deserved the smack on the hand. I have always felt that what goes around comes around. Courtesy get courtesy back. There is always two sides to the story when cops get cited.

To the rookies: How to avoid getting stopped.

Rule #1 Don't break the law.

If you do get stopped for a bone headed move.....

Rule #2 Don't whip that badge out and say, "I'm a Cop". I know guys that will write you in a NEW YORK second for that action. Always be non-chalant and professional. Just having your ID out to see is good enough while grabbing your license.

Rule #3 When the officer walks up simply say that you want him or her to know that you have your "duty" or "off duty" weapon in the vehicle and where it is located while you are pulling your license out. This way the point gets across without you acting like a total goof.

Last edited @ 8/10/2007 5:36 PM

RE: How do you feel about professional courtesy?

Heh Aqua...rule 2 reminded me of a Security Officer who tried that. Whipped out his badge to convince the PO to let him go. He got arrested for impersonating an officer and attempting to bribe <G>. Ah well, stupid is as stupid does .

As far as 3 goes, I always turn the car off, put my hands on the wheel, tell the PO I'm an offduty SO with sidearm/concealed weapon and my wallet with appropriate paperwork is in my left rear pocket. I find being very exact helps defuse the tension that arrises when you say "I'm armed".